Express Boxcar ?

[NW Mailing List]

In support of Jim's thesis, compare the side sill shapes.  The cars in  the 
Thieme photo have side sills like the BS/BSb in that picture.  In  
contrast, here's a B-8 from the NWHS Archives -
 
_http://www.nwhs.org/archivesdb/detail.php?ID=1272_ 
(http://www.nwhs.org/archivesdb/detail.php?ID=1272) .   Also, this picture confirms Jim's point 
about the doors.
 
So, while apparently some B-8's were modified for this kind of service,  
that's not what's in the Thieme photograph.
 
Dave Phelps
 
 
In a message dated 5/22/2011 10:24:23 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org writes:

 
This photo is on page 24 of the Thieme book.  These are not Class Ef  box 
express cars; those cars had an inset door, like a baggage car, that  opened 
by sliding it inside the body; additionally, the doors were shorter in  
height and there was a section of the side that was "solid" above the door  ope
ning.  Here is a link: 
_http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns1715.jpeg_ 
(http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns1715.jpeg)  
The cars in the Thieme photo are definetely freight boxcars that have  been 
converted for passenger train service.  These are not Class B-8  boxcars; 
the B-8 cars had an 8-foot wide door and clearly these are 6-foot  wide 
doors. 
I believe these are Class BSb boxcars; here is an image of the Class BS  
boxcars: 
_http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/F1/NS3230.JPG_ 
(http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/F1/NS3230.JPG)  
At some point, these cars were rebuilt; some were made single door cars  
with a door opening of 6-foot and reclassified BSb.  The info I have  suggests 
the original class was built in 1927-28 time frame.  The  Railroad Spec - 
Bill of Materials is No. 373 and a General Arrangement  Drawiing of G-27252.  
The BSb class is what I believe to be  represented in the Thieme photo.   
As Gordon has pointed out, cars in passenger service require different  
equipment.  My "guess" is these cars were excess boxcars that were  modified to 
run in passenger service; they were pressed into service as mail  storage 
cars and used during the Christmas season.  Remember, in the  1950s, there 
was no UPS or FedEx; and the REA relied on the railroads as  well.  Another 
"guess" is that once converted, these cars were simply  stored when not 
needed.  Perhaps somewhere in the Archives there is  documentation of this 
conversion.   
The B-8 cars were virtually brand new when this photo was taken by Mr.  
Thieme.  The N&W would not have made extensive changes to a new car  for a 
temporary service.  There were some cars, classed B-8A I believe,  that were in 
dedicated LCL service. 
Jim Brewer 
Glenwood MD 
----- Original Message -----
From: "NW Mailing List"  <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "NW Mailing List"  <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2011 11:33:36  PM
Subject: Re: Express Boxcar ?

Dave,
 
Here are a few comments that others  may be able to augment.  First, I'm 
not convinced that the two  box-express cars are B8's.  Second, whatever they 
are, in order to  operate in a passenger train they would have to be 
equipped with a  passenger-type air brake control valve, a communication signal 
line and a  steam trainline.  So, equipment converted like this should be  
listed somewhere by the N&W.
 
I found information on Class Ef  box express cars No. 220 - 228 and 230 - 
239 in N&W Motive Power Data Book  No. 1.  These are the only box express 
cars listed in the  two copies of  Data Book No. 1 that I checked.  One copy is 
 dated Aug. 15, 1951 and the other is dated April 1, 1953, so these  
bracket the listed date of August Thieme's photo, Dec. 6, 1952.
 
Both copies of Data Book No. 1 have  the same information for the Class Ef 
cars, viz., No. 220 - 228 "Roanoke Shops  1929," and No. 230 - 239 
"Converted from BSb box car 1941."  So,  these must have been the cars in service 
when Thieme took his photo.   Incidentally, the Class BSb box  cars had 
"Dreadnaught" corrugated ends similar to the ends visible in the  photo.
 
Gordon Hamilton
 
----- Original Message ----- 

From:  _NW Mailing List_ (mailto:nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org)   
To: _nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org_ (mailto:nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org)  
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2011 8:50  PM
Subject: Re: Express Boxcar ?


A Google search took me to the OGR Forum, where someone pointed out  that 
per the NWHS web site, N&W had converted some B-8 boxcars to  express 
service.  If you look closely at the end corrugations of the  first car, it screams 
"Pullman PS-1" at you, i.e. B-8.  However, a  quick look through my 
reference materials yielded no details, listing of  cars converted, or installation 
of passenger air brake systems.  So,  that's about all I can contribute - 
hopefully others have more  information.
 
Dave Phelps
 
 
In a message dated 5/20/2011 7:43:05 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org writes:

 
Can someone enlighten me as to what class of  box car is seen in the 
following photo behind the K1  locomotive?
 
_http://www.nwhs.org/archivesdb/detail.php?ID=5556_ 
(http://www.nwhs.org/archivesdb/detail.php?ID=5556) 
 
What color they may they have been  painted?
 
Jimmy  Lisle



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