[steam_tech] Re: TRAINS.com latest- can steam make a comeback?

[NW Mailing List]

I was told by some old car knockers at Petersburg, VA that an A could  
couple up to 100+ cars at Seacoast and take them  away with the angle  
cock open on the other end and the air hose sticking  straight out and  
go to Crewe!!

Walt Gay
Grumpy ex-car knocker


On May 28, 2008, at 4:19 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:


> Apparently you did not catch my previous posts wondering whether the  

> Class A regularly hauled 7500 ton trains over 60 mph. I had been  

> wondering if this was an urban legend.

>

> Likewise, the corroboration that they did indeed haul such heavy  

> trains at such a speed on TRAINS.com, the line whether steam can  

> make a comeback.

>

> If you check LeMassena's "Turntable" in the January 1974 TRAINS, you  

> will find EMD performance figures that a single SD45 can haul a 5000  

> ton train at 35 mph, two at 51 mph, three at 62 mph, and four at 70  

> mph.

>

> To haul a 7500 train over 60 mph, then, is the work of 4 1/2 SD45s.

>

> Figure three SD45s can haul a 7500 ton train at 51 mph, then. How  

> fast could three 4300 hp SD70s haul it? This is not quite 20% more  

> power than the SD45s. It takes 50% more to haul it 62 mph. So only  

> 20% more would fall far short of 60 mph.

>

> What is well documented but little realized is that diesels are  

> very, very expensive on fast, heavy trains. The railroads dieselized  

> on fast, light trains and slow, heavy trains, on which the diesel's  

> advantages are most apparent. Within a decade of dieselization, they  

> had to run fast, heavy trains, on which it is a different story.

>

> Any more specifics on the 1200s hauling 7500 ton trains at 60 mph  

> would be most germane.

>

> Again, let's get 1218 back into shape to do it again. Three SD70s  

> trying the same thing could be the steam/diesel test that really  

> proves something.

>

> --- On Mon, 5/26/08, NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote:

> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> Subject: Re: [steam_tech] Re: TRAINS.com latest- can steam make a  

> comeback?

> To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> Date: Monday, May 26, 2008, 3:41 PM

>

> Speed is all about horsepower.  I'm not enough into Diseasels to  

> know how much HP an SD 70 has, but I think its around 4000.  Three  

> SD 70s would have about twice the HP of an A.  No contest!

>

> pete groom

> On May 26, 2008, at 8:23 AM, NW Mailing List wrote:

>

>

>

> Note: forwarded message attached.

>

>

>

> From: "herbgarratt" <herbgarratt at yahoo.com>

> Date: May 25, 2008 9:48:37 PM PDT

> To: steam_tech at yahoogroups.com

> Subject: [steam_tech] Re: TRAINS.com latest- can steam make a  

> comeback?

> Reply-To: steam_tech at yahoogroups.com

>

>

> Wooly, Bill, et al,

>

> After the stunning vids I've seen of that gorgeous lok, reading this

> about makes me weep!

>

> Cheers (if that is even appropriate? ),

> Oz Pete

>

> --- In steam_tech at yahoogro ups.com, <wooly421 at .. .> wrote:

> >

> > Is n't the 1218 about all cut up as far as boiler etc. & just put

> back together for display at Virginia Museum of Transportation after

> the last steam no steam deal on NS. She was saved to start with when

> she was a portable boiler somewhere down there in the south

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ---- william wendt <wholelephant@ ...> wrote:

> > > Maybe this will settle somthing.

> > >

> > > Let's see what 1218 can do with a 7500 ton train on straight,

> level track, maybe even where the Class A's regularly hauled such

> trains 60 mph or so.

> > >

> > > And let's see what three SD70s can do with such a train. My guess

> is they will not quite make it to 60 mph.

> > >

> > > And of course we keep close track of the fuel and water

> consumption.

> > >

> > > Let's see what is more economical by today's prices to run heavy

> trains at such speed.

> > >

> > > The capital costs are more speculative. The prices of diesels are

> well known, but what it would cost to produce steam locomotives in

> any quantity is speculative indeed.

> > >

> > > And if we did produce new steam, it would be with the

> Porta/Wardale boiler, Lempor exhaust, poppet valves, and 300 lb

> pressure. How much these would be worth is speculative too, but some

> reaonable estimate should not be beyond reach.

> > >

> > > It is speculative too how much interest rates will rise, but not

> especially speculative they will rise considerably in the reasonably

> near future. Higher interest rates will greatly favor the lower

> capital costs of steam. Not only that, but they will put a premium on

> train speed, not unlike on the old Great Northern silk trains.

> > >

> > > This would be a steam/diesel comparison at the speeds that matter

> now. And it is not that diesels cannot haul heavy trains fast. It is

> that they are very expensive in such service, at least by data from

> twenty years ago.

> > >

> > > So let's let 1218 strut her stuff. Even her seven decade old

> technology might be more economical in such service than the latest

> diesels.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------ --------- --------- ------

> > >

> > > Yahoo! Groups Links

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

>

>

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