NW-Modeling-List Digest, Vol 232, Issue 35

Mon Apr 25 08:21:24 EDT 2022

Well.A few months back I wandered through the web and found a Class M boiler, which I thought might be the hardest thing for a beginning scratch builder. Someplace I have a Mehano Pacific and Mikado to cannibalize for chassis. 4-6-2 + 2-8-2 = 4-8-0 and leftover 2-6-2. And I have the wonderful Modeler’s Guide to the Class M. Just have to get it all together in one place and stir in some hours. For my little modules one will do.
Jeff Cornelius

Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS

On Sunday, April 24, 2022, 22:53, NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org> wrote:

Wow, I think I jumped on a fast train to nowhere! Everyone makes valid points pro and con brass vs. plastic, BLI etc. To each his own; Modeling Railroading Is Fun.
Now I will stick my neck out and venture a truth: neither BLI nor Rapido, nor any other manufacturer, will ever produce an M, M2, Y4, Y5 or Y6.
And from experience: brass locomotives are finicky, but last a long time; BLI models are very nice, but have a spotty record for functioning and repairs. Everyone will have their own experience, but BLI locos will not be functioning over many years. My Sunset M motors on.
And for the record, the late Claud Abernathy and I put together perhaps the most extensive package of data on the Class M series for Sunset to produce in O two rail. We tried very hard to get Mr. Mann to also produce an HO series, in brass of course, but he declined. He didn't think the market would support it. He was probably right.
Just a thought: I am building two C&O passenger cars using 3-D printed sides that are beautiful pieces of work. And the COHS plans to do more car types not otherwise available. Perhaps there could be a market for parts and pieces to convert models to other classes, etc. Again, just a thought. We have only scratched the surface of 3D printing.
Peace and model on!Bill  Bill McClure
www.billmcclure.smugmug.comwww.mcclureimages.com

On Sun, Apr 24, 2022 at 7:06 PM <nw-modeling-list-request at nwhs.org> wrote:

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: BLI Y-6 wishes (NW Modeling List)
   2. Re: BLI Y-6 wishes (NW Modeling List)

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Message: 1
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 01:41:10 +0000 (UTC)
From: NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
To: NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Subject: Re: BLI Y-6 wishes
Message-ID: <mailman.359.1650811747.179012.nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Good for you! As a doctor I'm sure you have enough money to buy $800-1,200 brass ones that don't wiggle.
The BLI and AHM/Rivarossi articulateds were designed for the average modelers who must live with ridiculously tight curves. Try a KEY Y-4 on 18-22"r and see what happens.?
I appreciate your thoughts and you are 100% right about these drives being wrong. That's just not how an articulated works. Abomonation? I don't think so. They were created to sell engines to guys that can operate them. They run well and serve the purpose.
As a very young modeler I returned home from a trip watching N&W steam to find my local hobby shop had the "new" Y-6b models. I had saved my grass cutting money and forked over the huge sum, for me, of $19.99 for one. I took it home and put it on my 18" layout and it ran like a dream. That's what AHM/Rivarossi was after.
I think people miss the whole point with our model trains that, first and foremost, they are simply toys with electric motors! Some are on the high end like the brass stuff but in the end they are toys. We generally do not buy nor want museum quality models as they would be too expensive and wouldn't operate well if everything were 100% to scale. Look at the excess detail on PSC A & Y models. Making them run reliably is difficult with all the fine details around the wheels. That stuff is beautiful but not practical on a layout which will have derailments bending and causing shorts.
My 2?.
Roger HuberDeer Creek Locomotive Works 

    On Saturday, April 23, 2022, 07:25:01 PM CDT, NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org> wrote:  

  I've watched this thread go on and on, and I? finally can't stand it anymore.? I have not bought,? and will never buy a BLI articulated, of they can't/won't get the articulation right.? The Rivarossi floating rear engine isn't necessary and even it the driver and flange sizes are better, it's still a glaring abomination.? They will never get my money if they can't make a proper engine.? Perhaps if they offered an M, since that is a solid frame engine, I would consider it.? But I will never buy a Y6a, or a Y6, or a Y5 from them if they insist on perpetuating an incorrect drive mechanism.?
Dr. J. Brent Greer?

Dr. J. Brent GreerFrom: NW-Modeling-List <nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org> on behalf of NW Modeling List via NW-Modeling-List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Saturday, April 23, 2022 11:50 AM
To: NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Cc: NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Subject: Re: BLI Y-6 wishes?I?ll join the list of those having suggested BLI do an Y-6/Y-6a. If I recall correctly, I emailed them shortly after they announced their Y-6b.
I noted that the Y-6?s and Y-6a?s outnumbered the B?s by nearly 3-to-1 on the N&W. And living about 15 miles from the prototype 2156 at the time, I even volunteered to measure/photograph it for them.
Their emailed answer to me?was, boiled down, thanks but no thanks. I took some solace in their at least getting the driver diameter correct, unlike the ancient Rivarossi model. LOL.
Andre Jackson
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

On Wednesday, April 20, 2022, 3:31 PM, NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org> wrote:

Certainly Broadway LTD has not been hampered in producing Pennsylvania RR locomotives.? It seems like a new PRR release every month or two.? Many years ago at the NMRA National Train Show in Philadelphia I spoke with a representative of Broadway.? They had already produced the Y6b and I suggested they could use the same mechanism and do the Y-5, Y-6 and Y-6a boilers.? I know?Harold Davenport also suggested this to them but obviously nothing has come of it.
It is my understanding that the PRRT&HS Modeling committee gathers together all the necessary documentation and travels to Florida to meet with the folks at Broadway to promote a new locomotive.? I have even heard a representative of the factory in China is often in attendance. Of course, it seems like anything with "PRR" on it sells well.
Jim Brewer

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Message: 2
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 17:47:28 +0000
From: NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
To: NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Subject: Re: BLI Y-6 wishes
Message-ID: <mailman.408.1650841566.179012.nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

There is a good compromise. Some years ago Oriental produced their Powerhouse series. These were brass hybrids with an excellent drive system, brass tenders, and a metal boiler. Not as well detailed as a brass engine, but very smooth runners. They were based on USRA designs. The articulated could be had with an N&W style tender as well as a USRA style. The rear drivers were fixed like the prototype so the boiler swings out like it should. They also did a Pacific, Mikado, and I think an articulated logger. You find these on auction sites and at shows. I have 3 of the N&W Ys as well as Mikados and a Pacific. They have run like a Swiss watch for years. Am in the process of converting them to DCC/sound, a pretty easy process.

Best,
Jerry A Shepardson

Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 24, 2022, at 10:49 AM, NW Modeling List via NW-Modeling-List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org> wrote:

?
Good for you! As a doctor I'm sure you have enough money to buy $800-1,200 brass ones that don't wiggle.

The BLI and AHM/Rivarossi articulateds were designed for the average modelers who must live with ridiculously tight curves. Try a KEY Y-4 on 18-22"r and see what happens.

I appreciate your thoughts and you are 100% right about these drives being wrong. That's just not how an articulated works. Abomonation? I don't think so. They were created to sell engines to guys that can operate them. They run well and serve the purpose.

As a very young modeler I returned home from a trip watching N&W steam to find my local hobby shop had the "new" Y-6b models. I had saved my grass cutting money and forked over the huge sum, for me, of $19.99 for one. I took it home and put it on my 18" layout and it ran like a dream. That's what AHM/Rivarossi was after.

I think people miss the whole point with our model trains that, first and foremost, they are simply toys with electric motors! Some are on the high end like the brass stuff but in the end they are toys. We generally do not buy nor want museum quality models as they would be too expensive and wouldn't operate well if everything were 100% to scale. Look at the excess detail on PSC A & Y models. Making them run reliably is difficult with all the fine details around the wheels. That stuff is beautiful but not practical on a layout which will have derailments bending and causing shorts.

My 2?.

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works

On Saturday, April 23, 2022, 07:25:01 PM CDT, NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org> wrote:

I've watched this thread go on and on, and I  finally can't stand it anymore.  I have not bought,  and will never buy a BLI articulated, of they can't/won't get the articulation right.  The Rivarossi floating rear engine isn't necessary and even it the driver and flange sizes are better, it's still a glaring abomination.  They will never get my money if they can't make a proper engine.  Perhaps if they offered an M, since that is a solid frame engine, I would consider it.  But I will never buy a Y6a, or a Y6, or a Y5 from them if they insist on perpetuating an incorrect drive mechanism.

Dr. J. Brent Greer

________________________________
Dr. J. Brent Greer
________________________________
From: NW-Modeling-List <nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org> on behalf of NW Modeling List via NW-Modeling-List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Saturday, April 23, 2022 11:50 AM
To: NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Cc: NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Subject: Re: BLI Y-6 wishes

I?ll join the list of those having suggested BLI do an Y-6/Y-6a. If I recall correctly, I emailed them shortly after they announced their Y-6b.

I noted that the Y-6?s and Y-6a?s outnumbered the B?s by nearly 3-to-1 on the N&W. And living about 15 miles from the prototype 2156 at the time, I even volunteered to measure/photograph it for them.

Their emailed answer to me was, boiled down, thanks but no thanks. I took some solace in their at least getting the driver diameter correct, unlike the ancient Rivarossi model. LOL.

Andre Jackson
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad<https://overview.mail.yahoo.com/?.src=iOS>

On Wednesday, April 20, 2022, 3:31 PM, NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org> wrote:

Certainly Broadway LTD has not been hampered in producing Pennsylvania RR locomotives.  It seems like a new PRR release every month or two.  Many years ago at the NMRA National Train Show in Philadelphia I spoke with a representative of Broadway.  They had already produced the Y6b and I suggested they could use the same mechanism and do the Y-5, Y-6 and Y-6a boilers.  I know Harold Davenport also suggested this to them but obviously nothing has come of it.

It is my understanding that the PRRT&HS Modeling committee gathers together all the necessary documentation and travels to Florida to meet with the folks at Broadway to promote a new locomotive.  I have even heard a representative of the factory in China is often in attendance. Of course, it seems like anything with "PRR" on it sells well.

Jim Brewer

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