Ballast deck bridges

[NW Modeling List]

This effort by NS to convert bridges has pushed me to make notes and photos
of any I am modeling (1950's).  Beyond the change in deck details, other
updating may be done like overcoating stonework with concrete or, in an
extreme case, replacing a rare deck truss span with concrete.

Regarding deck details (bridge ties), N&W bridges seem to have a certain
"heft" to them absent in bridge models I've seen and perhaps on other
roads, given that 8" square bridge ties are common in HO scale.  Seems the
N&W standard is 10" square (x 10' long) on 15" centers, but are not readily
available in HO.  Kappler Mill & Lumber agreed to a custom order of
N&W-spec bridge ties in sugar pine to match their standard cross ties and
at their regular pricing.

Grant Carpenter



> [Original Message]

> Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2012 10:35:17 -0500

> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> Subject: Ballast deck bridges

> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org

> Message-ID: <380-220124412153517578 at mindspring.com>

> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

>

> The reverse trend on NS is to convert curved bridges, especially on the

> Pokey, to ballast deck because of alignment problems at the abutments and

> the non-standard bridge ties.  Bridge ties are pre-cut or "dapped" to help

> superelevate the curve, but must allow for girder horizontal (chord)

> alignment and vertical alignment for increasing flange thickness towards

> the span center, even for any rivets under each tie.  So each tie must be

> individually cut and tagged with a serial number and are ordered from an

> outside supplier with a lead time of 6-8 months.  In comparison, ballast

> decks start looking cheap and easy.

>

> Grant Carpenter

>

> > Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:37:00 -0400 (EDT)

> > From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> > Subject: Re: Clinch Valley Division CV 464.01 over Clear Creek, Norton

> > 	vicinity,	Wise County, VA

> >

> > Is it possible the superstructure was rebuilt in 1939 and yet this

> information may not have been included within the archived records.

However

> I also wonder why an existing bridge would need replacement after only 20

> years of service?

> >  

> > Any advice, thought or suggestion would be appreciated.  Thank you for

> your time.

> > Joe-

> >  

> > Ballasted deck trestles were a rarity on the N&W .  This type of span

had

> an advantage--

> > it used common, everyday cross ties. Steel spans required cut to order

> bridge ties. The

> > ballasted deck trestle had a huge disadvantage -- failure to drain

> properly.  Although

> > Atlantic Coast Line (for one) had many ballasted deck trestles, N&W

> preferred steel spans.

> > After all, N&W could produce its own ties at the Radford plant.  After

20

> years of service,

> > the bridge at Clear Creek may have begun to show the results of poor

> drainage--

> > accumulating weight on the concrete slabs,  piers settling, etc.        

> Harry Bundy

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------

>

> Message: 3

> Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2012 07:37:22 -0400 (EDT)

> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> Subject: Re: SD45 1728

> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org

> Message-ID: <75229.14f070af.3cb81872 at aol.com>

> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

>

>

>

>  

> In a message dated 4/12/2012 6:37:46 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  

> nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org writes:

>

> don?t  think that date has occurred yet.  OPPS.  10-31-74 

> Don  T. 

>  

>  

> From:  nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org 

> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org]  On Behalf Of NW Mailing List

> Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012  6:23 PM

> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org

> Subject: Re: SD45  1728

>

>  

>

>  

>

>  

> In a  message dated 4/11/2012 8:57:29 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, 

> _nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org_ (mailto:nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org)   writes:

>

> In  trying research I have not found  when SD-45 1728 was wrecked on the  

> Reading and rebuilt with the low nose.  I would like to model this unit 

with 

> a low nose and need to know if if fits into my modeling  era.

>  

>

>  

> 10-31-14  WRECKED ON READING R/R AT LEE'S CROSSROADS, MD.  REBUILT INTO

LOW 

> NOSE  MODEL BY READING R/R  WITH BI-DI CONTROL STAND INSTEAD OF DUAL 

> CONTROL  STANDS

>  

>

>  

> BOB  B.

>

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> Message: 4

> Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2012 10:35:12 -0500

> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> Subject: RE: N&W Manual Blocking Procedures

> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org

> Message-ID: <380-220124412153512781 at mindspring.com>

> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

>

> As I understand in this situation, the Manual Block Signal is the Train

> Order Signal and must display the Stop indication to pick up orders and

the

> Clearance Card.  All else being normal and block clear, the train proceeds

> to the meet/pass at an appropriate speed per the instructions on the

orders.

>

> Grant Carpenter

>

>

> > [Original Message]

> > Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 16:49:23 +0000 (UTC)

> > From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> > Subject: Question re N&W Manual Blocking Procedures

> > To: N&W Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> >

> > I am probably at least 50 year too late in asking this question about

N&W

> Manual Block procedures, but here goes... 

> >

> >

> >

> > The Clearance Card, N&W Form CT-37 1/2 (revision of 2-1-1941,) which was

> still in use when I hired in 1964, has a curious final line, which leads

me

> to question how the N&W handled the manual blocking of trains in territory

> where Time Table/Train Order was the method operation, and on which the

> Manual Block System had been superimposed as a second level of

protection. 

> >

> >

> >

> > I'll attach a scan of that Clearance Card.? The last line on the card is

> a fill-in-the-blanks line reading:? "Signal is displayed for ___ and ___

to

> meet (or pass) as per Order No. ___.? Except as stated, Block is clear." 

> >

> >

> >

> > This line was obviously provided for a situation where trains meet (or

> pass) at a "blind siding" (no open Train Order Office.) 

> >

> >

> >

> > This raises the immediate question:? When a train received a Clearance

> Card with this line filled out, what was done with the Manual Block

> Signal?? Was it held at Stop, or raised to Permissive, or raised to

Clear??

> And furthermore, if the signal was held at Stop or displayed at

Permissive,

> at what speed did the train proceed to the meeting/passing point? 

> >

> >

> >

> > Unfortunately, I never worked over any N&W territory where the method of

> operation was Time Table/Train Order + Manual Block System.? And I don't

> think I've ever seen the situation addressed in any of the old rule

books. 

> >

> >

> >

> > -- abram burnett 

> >

> > /////////////////////////////////// 

> > ?No man can hear his telephone ring without 

> > wishing heartily that Alexander Graham Bell had 

> > been run over by an ice wagon at the age of 4.? 

> >

> > ??--H.L. Mencken 

> > ///////////////////////////////

>

>

>

> ------------------------------

>

> Message: 5

> Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2012 12:06:43 -0400

> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> Subject: "Takin' Twenty" with the Virginian Brethren by Skip Salmon

> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> Message-ID: <4F86FD93.5060601 at vt.edu>

> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

>

> Last night I had the pleasure of "Takin' Twenty" with six of the

> Brethren and Friends of the Virginian Railway. There was a lot of

> discussion about last Friday's front and back page article about the

> Restoration of the Virginian Station in Roanoke with 8 color

> photographs. This is probably the biggest article ever in the "Roanoke

> Times" about the Virginian Railway, and the Brethren were proud to read

it.

>

> For Show and Tell, I took the 2011 Norfolk Southern, 1980 Norfolk and

> Western, and the 1958 Virginian, Annual Reports. It was interesting to

> see the differences in the three. One thing that stood out was the

> operating ratios, the expense it takes to make a dollar's profit from

> each. 1958 VGN: 51 cents to make a dollar; 1980 N&W: 78 cents to make a

> dollar, and 2011 Norfolk Southern: 71 cents to make a dollar. The

> Brethren especially enjoyed looking at the 1958 VGN Report. This is the

> one I have had over 60 former VGN employees sign. They remembered many

> signers, who have since "taken the westbound".

>

> Also shown were photos of the two latest Norfolk Southern Heritage

> locomotives, fresh out of the paint shop: Central of Georgia #8101 and

> Norfolk and Western #8103. Most of the Brethren liked the Central of

> Georgia, but as they did back in 1965, did not like the Pevler blue,

> hamburger logo N&W scheme.

>

> The Jewel from the Past is from December 22, 2005: "I asked R. R.

> McDaniel about sanding the electrics, and he said all of the spouts were

> on the side. He recalled that after sanding, the electrics were placed

> in the Motor Barn for servicing. A large cut-out switch dis-connected

> the overhead wire from the 11,000 volts. Workers would lock the big

> switch open and carry the key to the lock on a ring around their neck,

> when they were on top of the electric locomotives, so no one else could

> close the switch and energize the line above them. He said one day he

> saw a laborer climbing the steps on one of the electrics with the key

> ring around his neck, but the switch was still in, making the line hot!

> He yelled 'the wire is still hot'. He got a reply, 'But, Captain, I got

> the ring around my neck'"...

>

> One discussion was about Gordon Hamilton's 1912 "Bluefield Daily

> Telegraph" story about a $75 Million bond issue to extend the VGN 250

> miles west to Cincinnati, OH. This also included Tom "Saltwater"

> Salmon's email comment and Gerry Albers' rebuttal. Most of the Brethren

> were glad the bond issue was never passed, and that their line was not

> extended westward.

>

> I passed around a current "Bluefield Daily Telegraph" article of April

> 6, 2012 "Train halt in moment of silence for 29 victims of UBB mine

> disaster" (north of Beckley). On Thursday, April 6, 2012 shortly before

> 3 PM, all trains stopped in the Bluefield Yard to honor the 29 miner's

> memory. Way to go NS!

>

> To answer questions form Russell Stiff, the Administrative Offices of

> the Virginian Railway were on the 5, 6, and 7 floor of the Union Station

> in Norfolk, VA, according to our friend Myron White who worked on the

> 6th floor there, in the Freight Claims Department. He said the

> President's Office was on the 7th floor. Also the VGN Operator at Walnut

> Ave Tower (JK) controlled the crossing of the N&W and VGN at the diamond

> at that location. Landon Gregory said the VGN Operator usually knew of

> the approaching N&W traffic, and lined up and signaled for the move.

>

> Also passed around was the March-April 2012 "NS-Biz" magazine which

> highlights the new "On track for the future" 5-year program that

> includes global positioning of all rolling stock and many more methods

> of making the line more efficient.

>

> I was able to tell the Brethren that in the Fall this year, the Roanoke

> Chapter NRHS will run excursion trains on November 10 to Spencer, NC (NC

> Museum of Transportation) and November 11 (Veteran's Day) to Shenandoah,

> VA from Roanoke. The Saturday train will use the old Virginian between

> Roanoke and Hurt, VA and on to the old Southern Piedmont Division and on

> to Spencer.

>

> Remember: Dogs will come when they are called; Cats have answering

machines!

>

> Time to pull the pin on this one!

>

> Departing Now from V248,

>

> Skip Salmon

>

> CDXV

>

> __._,_.___

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