Engine coal question
NW Mailing List
nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
Wed Jul 18 17:50:17 EDT 2012
In "A Short History of the Norfolk & Western Railway," by N&W President R.
H. Smith, p. 24, mention is made of the urgency for reaching the on-line
coal deposits at Pocahontas, so as to provide fuel for N&W locomotives. The
first car shipped on March 12, 1883, in fact, was for N&W locomotives.
Before that time, "The coal came from mines farther North in West Virginia
and Pennsylvania, and cost $3.60 per ton, an outrageous price for those
days." The second car went to Norfolk. The remaining wood-burning
locomotives were soon converted to coal.
Louis Newton
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> 1. Re: Shenandoah Junction questions (NW Mailing List)
> 2. Re: G.S. Tower Portsmouth (NW Mailing List)
> 3. RE: G.S. Tower Portsmouth (NW Mailing List)
> 4. Shenandoah Junction (NW Mailing List)
> 5. Portsmouth,OH Passenger Station. (NW Mailing List)
> 6. Re: Engine Coal Question (NW Mailing List)
> 7. RE: Portsmouth,OH Passenger Station. (NW Mailing List)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 12:26:11 -0400
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: Re: Shenandoah Junction questions
> To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Message-ID:
> <bb69723fb69fe078e1f385850c3b0b9f.squirrel at lightning.svaha.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>
>> First, the Shenandoah Valley RR/N&W never crossed the B&O main line at
> grade at Shenandoah Junction. From newspaper archives I have studied
> from the 1880 period, the SV crossed the B&O on a trestle. The story is
> that B&O was vehemently opposed to SV crossing their railroad at all
> because B&O had their own design on building a railroad into the valley.
>>From local lore I have heard that SV put the trestle spanning the B&O in
> place on a Sunday when B&O could not get a court order to stop them. On
> the north side, SV track approached on high ground, and on the south
> side a long wood trestle was the approach to the crossover. After N&W
> bought the SV, the long approach was back filled. The interchange
> tracks into the station were maintained to mainline standards. Nothing
> is interchanged there today, as CSX routes all NS interchange traffic
> through Hagerstown.
>
> The Shenandoah Jct station remained open approximately a year or two after
> the last N&W passenger service ended May 19, 1962. One B&O passenger
> train, a westbound, was still scheduled to stop there. If my memory is
> correct, the station was demolished by 1964. It was the original SV
> structure, but the exterior is evidence of the 1909 remodelling. Check
> out photos on the Virginia Tech website.
>
> --Rick Morrison
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Subject: Shenandoah Junction questions
>>
>>
>> All:
>> Do we know both when the long-familiar Shenandoah Junction depot was
>> uilt and when it was dismantled? It had that familiar Shenandoah
>> alley "cookie-cutter" type look to it, as I remember from the photos
>> have seen.
>> Bob:
>> N&W's 1919 annual report lists several passenger and freight stations
>> that were built or remodeled. Shenandoah Jct. is mentioned, but it
>> does't
>> define the work accomplished. Maybe you know; maybe you don't, but
>> Shenadoah Jct. is NOT on the Roanoke-Hagerstown main line. A lead veers
>> to the east north of MP H-215 and drops down to the B&O level. The
>> distance from MP H-215 to MP H-217 is only 6,716 feet. There is no MP
>> H-216 on the main line, but there is one on the lead to the B&O, so
>> apparently the old main line went into Shenandoah Jct. and crossed the
>> B&O at grade at one time. Harry Bundy
>>
>> ________________________________________
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>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 10:36:50 -0400
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: Re: G.S. Tower Portsmouth
> To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Message-ID: <09C027BD96FE45BB9EFE9C05F99510F7 at LenovoG550>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> reply-type=response
>
> GS tower in Portsmouth was opened in 1931 (or possibly late 1930; I can
> get
> exact year later). It was a two-story brick building containing a 31
> lever
> electro pneumatic machine with 25 working levers, of which 15 controlled
> switches and 5 derails, and 8 controlled 21 signals, with the remaining 2
> were for check locking. It controlled the crossing of a B&O freight line
> and the entrance to the classification yard.
> Glenn Fisher
> Cornwall PA
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 8:52 AM
> To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: Re: G.S. Tower Portsmouth
>
>> Thanks Jim. While we're on the subject, do you happen to know when it
>> (GS)
>> opened? It's not listed in the 10/31/65 timetable but it is shown in the
>> 9/21/69 issue.
>>
>> Ron
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>> To: "'NW Mailing List'" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 12:02 AM
>> Subject: RE: G.S. Tower Portsmouth
>>
>>
>>> Closest date I have ever found on the closing of GS Tower in Portsmouth
>>> was
>>> mid December 1980. Somewhere are copies of the Scioto Division
>>> Superintendent's Bulletins for the period that would give an exact date,
>>> but
>>> I have never seen them. Although you didn't ask, GS was razed on October
>>> 11,
>>> 1988.
>>>
>>> Jim Detty
>>> Lucasville, Ohio
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
>>> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 1:29 PM
>>> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>>> Subject: G.S. Tower Portsmouth
>>>
>>> Trying to determine when G.S. TOWER (Gallia Street) in Portsmouth was
>>> closed...it was still listed in Scioto Division timetable #7 (July 8,
>>> 1979)
>>> but I have nothing after that to reference.
>>>
>>> Same goes for the Train Order office at EAST WILLIAMSON (also open July
>>> 8,
>>> 1979).
>>>
>>> Can anyone assist?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Ron
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________________
>>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
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>>
>> ________________________________________
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>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:02:44 -0400
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: RE: G.S. Tower Portsmouth
> To: "'NW Mailing List'" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Message-ID: <EFB049F31FB146FD9DB0ADC06CB0BE00 at TheDettysPC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> GS Tower opened on August 13, 1930.
>
> Jim Detty
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
> Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 8:52 AM
> To: NW Mailing List
> Subject: Re: G.S. Tower Portsmouth
>
> Thanks Jim. While we're on the subject, do you happen to know when it (GS)
> opened? It's not listed in the 10/31/65 timetable but it is shown in the
> 9/21/69 issue.
>
> Ron
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> To: "'NW Mailing List'" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 12:02 AM
> Subject: RE: G.S. Tower Portsmouth
>
>
>> Closest date I have ever found on the closing of GS Tower in Portsmouth
>> was
>> mid December 1980. Somewhere are copies of the Scioto Division
>> Superintendent's Bulletins for the period that would give an exact date,
>> but
>> I have never seen them. Although you didn't ask, GS was razed on October
>> 11,
>> 1988.
>>
>> Jim Detty
>> Lucasville, Ohio
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
>> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 1:29 PM
>> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>> Subject: G.S. Tower Portsmouth
>>
>> Trying to determine when G.S. TOWER (Gallia Street) in Portsmouth was
>> closed...it was still listed in Scioto Division timetable #7 (July 8,
>> 1979)
>> but I have nothing after that to reference.
>>
>> Same goes for the Train Order office at EAST WILLIAMSON (also open July
>> 8,
>> 1979).
>>
>> Can anyone assist?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Ron
>>
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
> ________________________________________
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>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:37:14 -0400
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: Shenandoah Junction
> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> Message-ID:
> <CAA+dkJksyraibzctTtXwoGZdekFTHq9wgiGHB=ptbRjayLbEBA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Thanks Harry and Ken and all for the information presented. Yes, I
> knew and know how the the track is setup at Shenandoah Junction for
> the former interchange between the B&O and N&W. Been there many times
> and the concrete footprint for the depot is still plainly evident. The
> curiosity issue still is when was the depot dismantled.
>
> As for the connection -- that issue was discussed several years ago --
> I remember the basics and it was concluded that there was never an
> at-grade interchange or intersection between the two railroads, dating
> back to when the SV railroad first came thru in 1880/1881. The
> Shenandoah Valley would have desired it; the B&O basically said no is
> what I remember and required the bridge. The milepost thing you
> mention is interesting -- that was a detail I never knew and thank you
> for sharing. It's amazing what one can learn here.
>
> Bob Cohen
>
>
> Shenandoah Junction questions
>
> All:
> Do we know both when the long-familiar Shenandoah Junction depot was
> built and when it was dismantled? It had that familiar Shenandoah
> Valley "cookie-cutter" type look to it, as I remember from the photos
> have seen.
>
> Bob:
>
> N&W's 1919 annual report lists several passenger and freight stations
> that were built or remodeled. Shenandoah Jct. is mentioned, but it
> doesn't define the work accomplished. Maybe you know; maybe you don't,
> but Shenandoah Jct. is NOT on the Roanoke-Hagerstown main line. A lead
> veers to the east north of MP H-215 and drops down to the B&O level.
> The distance from MP H-215 to MP H-217 is only 6,716 feet. There is no
> MP H-216 on the main line, but there is one on the lead to the B&O, so
> apparently the old main line went into Shenandoah Jct. and crossed the
> B&O at grade at one time.
>
> Harry Bundy
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 14:32:22 -0400
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: Portsmouth,OH Passenger Station.
> To: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Message-ID: <SNT129-W345136B54D31B112C606FC4DA0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Reading the emails about the GS tower reminded me that I was in Portsmouth
> a few years ago the week NS stupidly tore down the N&W Passenger station.
> I crossed the route 23 overpass and looked over to see it in rubble. I
> couldn't believe it, so sad. All I could think was all the J,A, and Y
> classes that rolled passed it for many years. But on reality that is
> today's railroad business. Just a thought.
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 13:28:34 -0400
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: Re: Engine Coal Question
> To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Message-ID: <9E48811978864E2C9DB98B21ED8BFFAA at lewisdl0ls5whv>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Abram,
>
> I don't have the answer to your total question about where the RR got its
> coal for locomotive fuel before 1883. Before the connection of the SV
> with the N&W RR at Roanoke in 1882, the railroad had to get it from
> somewhere along its origninal route in southwestern Virginia where coal
> was being produced.
>
> The AM&O began the conversion from wood to coal on its engines in 1876.
> This involved mostly the old V&T portion of the line initially. The 1884
> N&W RR Annual Report states that the conversion from wood to coal was
> completed in that year for the entire railroad.
>
> Bud Jeffries
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: NW Mailing List
> To: N&W Mailing List
> Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 4:28 PM
> Subject: Engine Coal Question
>
>
> Where did the N&W get its engine coal before the Pocohontas Mine was
> opened in 1883? Was it fetched down the Shenandoah Valley RR from
> Pennsylvania?
>
>
>
> And... wouldn't it be fascinating to discover a first person account of
> the conversion from wood to coal as engine fuel, complete with a listing
> of "wood stations" along the line ? !!!
>
>
>
> -- abram burnett
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> ________________________________________
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 15:40:05 -0400
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: RE: Portsmouth,OH Passenger Station.
> To: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Message-ID: <SNT121-W1204CF7748BD1A0EECB107B2DA0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
>
>
> Re- Portsmouth Passenger station. NS sold the property to Scioto County,
> the new Sherrif's Office/ jail is built on that site.
> The front of the building resembles the old passenger station.
>
> Thank You,
> Jim Dempsey
>
>
> Southern Ohio Fence Company, LLC
> 175 Kennison Road Lucasville, Ohio 45648
> sofence at msn.com
> Office Phone (740) 259-5378
> Office Phone (800) 398-5425
> Office Fax (740) 259-4545
> Jim's Cell (740) 935-5378
> Visit our website at www.southernohiofencecompany.com
>
>
> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> Subject: Portsmouth,OH Passenger Station.
> Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 14:32:22 -0400
> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>
>
>
>
> Reading the emails about the GS tower reminded me that I was in Portsmouth
> a few years ago the week NS stupidly tore down the N&W Passenger station.
> I crossed the route 23 overpass and looked over to see it in rubble. I
> couldn't believe it, so sad. All I could think was all the J,A, and Y
> classes that rolled passed it for many years. But on reality that is
> today's railroad business. Just a thought.
>
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
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