"Bottling the Air"

[NW Mailing List]

When I started working as a car inspector on SCL in 1971 at Collier, the yard foreman(Conductor) bled the cars off when he walked and put on the chalk marks indicating the track number that the cars were to be switched into. 

Walt Gay
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: NW Mailing List 
  To: NW Mailing List 
  Sent: Monday, October 25, 2010 1:57 PM
  Subject: Re: "Bottling the Air"


        Jim,

        The process of getting the cars bleed off, at least at Roanoke, has changed through the years. Thirty years ago (and before), N&W employed "air bleeders". These men's sole job consisted of bleeding the air off the trains after they arrived in the receiving yard. Either before, or after, the car department finished inspecting an inbound train, the air bleeders, as instructed by the yardmaster, would walk the entire train, bleeding the air off all the cars, except, leaving enough air and/or handbrakes to ensure the cars would not move. 

        When a yard engine was coupled to a track to hump, the brakeman would then remove any remaining brakes (air or hand).

        At the present time, the bleedding of the cars is handled by the car department (car knockers, car monkeys, etc), who bleed the cars as they inspect the inbound trains. Train or yard crews still handle the brakes, as necessary.

        Jeff Sanders   

        --- On Mon, 10/25/10, NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote:


          From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
          Subject: Re: "Bottling the Air"
          To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
          Date: Monday, October 25, 2010, 12:41 PM


          What was done at Bluefield was simply a variation of what they still do in "hump" yards (where retarders are used instead of riders). Which makes me wonder - how do they go about releasing the brakes on cars that are humped? I can see the men working the cut levers at the Radnor hump in Nashville, but I don't see them doing anything with the angle cocks. In Bluefield there were riders in proportion to the length of the cut to do the braking, and there was a big motor car which brought the riders back up to the scale house. Once in awhile, not enough riders would get on a cut, and there would be a big derailment when the cut got down to the cars already at the east end.
               As to the length of time to pump up an entire train, that is why N&W put the second air pump on the S1a's and retrofitted the S1's. I can remember a railroader saying that the first S1's assigned to Williamson took a long time to pump up the train. (they were accustomed to the two pumps on a Z1a) Shortly afterward, the 200 came out of Roanoke with two pumps. How C&O got by with one pump all those years is a mystery. They obviously had a different operating philosophy from N&W.    Jim Nichols




----------------------------------------------------------------------
          From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
          To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
          Sent: Mon, October 25, 2010 10:12:46 AM
          Subject: Re: "Bottling the Air"

          Gene 


          Technically I would seriously doubt that.


          What was done on what you saw, and someone who actually was a brakeman/conductor like Jeff could confirm. In Bluefield yard, and other places, the cars were set out on tracks, and a certain number of cars had hand brakes tied down. That would depend on the size of the cut as to how many brakes were tied down. Once hand brakes were tied down, the switch engine would cut off, the air on the cut was dumped, causing an emergency application, but hand brakes had already been applied. Over time, the air system would leak off, depending on how long they had sat.


          Once the yard shifter came in and coupled on to the cut, and applied its independent brake (for the locomotive) to hold it all in place. The brake systems on the cars had probably sat long enough that most if not all the air had bleed off the system, but the brakemen would walk along the cut to the triple valve on each car, and bleed off the remaining air, to release all air brakes. The brakemen did not couple the air line, therefore the hand brakes were all that would hold the cut. The hand brakes would still be on, once the air had been bleed, the brakemen would go along and release the hand brakes, the switch engine would pull back out, with the cut, into the clear, then shove the cut towards where they were to be put, if they were sorting cars, one man would pull the cut lever between the cars, and a brakeman would ride the cut, if needed for controlling the speed with the hand brake, while the cars rolled down into its track and couple with the other cars in that track, the brakeman would tie down the hand brakes, and the go back and do it again with another cut, etc.


          Generally handing rolling cars, not coupled to a locomotive, was rarely done with air in the system. As Harry reported, air pumping can take some time to fill the entire train line. You used to see with the diesels, running at high RPMs while standing, the engineer, is running the diesel up to run the compressor faster, and pump air through the train quicker. A number of factors can determine how long it takes to pump a train, including, of course, train length, cold weather, how many leaks are in the system and how much initial terminal time that crew wants to report on their time sheet! I've heard of occasions where it would take several hours of pumping time to release all the brakes in a coal train.


          In my younger days, when I was riding my bicycle down to the track, I'd sit and watch, and see eastbound coal trains get stopped by the signal at VN before going into South Yard, once the signal cleared, it might take them 30-45 minutes to pump air before they moved, and that was in good weather. They were great days, and I wish I had the interest and time to do that today, but alas, I have neither today.


          Ken Miller


          On Oct 25, 2010, at 9:12 AM, NW Mailing List wrote:


            Ken;

            Bluefield had a natural grade in both the East and West yard with the high point being in the area of the Round House. I remember as a young fellow in the East End of Bluefield, watching the "yard shifters" sorting the cars. There would be a number of cars released to freely roll to an appointed switch to make up trains. The Yard brakeman with his brake stick would control the speed until making couple with the other cars. I remember watching the men try to time the coupling just right and jump up in the air so as to miss the coming jolt of the sudden stop. I assume that free roll had to be done by "bottling the air", which was a common practice even in the late 50's. Also I remember watching "road shifters" push cars up to a speed and then stopping the locomotive allowing the cars to run freely though a switch, either coming to a stop on their own, or making couple with other cars.

            Gene Arnold 


            "Bottling the air" which I think, is now prohibited by most rule  
            books, means to close the angle cock (air line) on both ends of the  
            car or cut of cars before separating them from the train. That way,  
            air stays in the system, and does not dump the air to emergency on  
            that car or cut of cars. It is, among other things, made to speed up  
            operations, as with air already in the train line of those cars, it  
            means that the locomotive air compressor, does not have to run as long  
            to pump air back into the system, which can be a considerable amount  
            of time, meaning the crew can get underway sooner.

            If the air is dumped from the car or cars, it sets those brake systems  
            into emergency, and to release those brakes, the air system has to be  
            pumped up again from the locomotive. By bottling the air, it means  
            that only hand brakes, or chocks may be holding the cut of cars in  
            place, which can lead to a drift off, or runaway, or difficulty  
            coupling if the brakes are not holding well.

            Ken Miller


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