N&W vs. Southern Railway

[nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org]

I've been in in SWVA over the weekend so I'm late getting back to you on 
your note......a good VaTech-BostonCollege game!  Thanks for the info..... 
In the past I belonged to all three (when I lived in Clemson, SC).  Glad to 
know that the 2 Southern Ry Societies (or Society and Association) got 
together........never seemed to be the best thing that the Southern folks 
were split.

Ed Painter (Narrows, VA - currently in Russellville, AR)



----- Original Message ----- 
From: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 6:29 AM
Subject: Re: N&W vs. Southern Railway



> Actually there is only one Southern Society now. The SRHA was absorbed by 

> the SRHS a couple of years ago, so the Spencer group is the only one. And 

> as a side note they have moved their Archives into one building for the 

> first time and are now working on organizing it. The collection is in the 

> top four in size, The N&W is in the top two or three. This is for 

> collections in one place that is, its my understanding that the PRR stuff 

> is scattered all over.

>

> Jason Greene

> Cumming, GA

> ----- Original Message ----- 

> From: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 5:44 PM

> Subject: Re: N&W vs. Southern Railway

>

>

>> The Southern Ry has 2 Historical Societies; one in Augusta, Ga and one in 

>> Spencer, NC.  You might wish to join one or both.  I'm sure they would be 

>> more to your liking than all of us coal dust covered N&W folks (Isn't 

>> coal dust green?). There's also an ACL/SAL Society.

>>

>> Increasing Shareholder's Wealth,  ROI,  ROE, Operating Ratio......... are 

>> among the true measures of success for management.  N&W management was as 

>> good as any at achieving outstanding results in these areas.  They were 

>> also better than most!

>>

>> Out of curiosity, what management level did you advance to when working 

>> for the ACL or SRR?  It's always valuable to understand the background 

>> and knowledge base for someone providing such critical and valuable 

>> management analysis!

>>

>> Ed Painter, Narrows, Va (Currently Russellville, AR)

>>

>>

>>

>> ----- Original Message ----- 

>> From: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> To: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2005 10:18 PM

>> Subject: N&W vs. Southern Railway

>>

>>

>>> Having worked for Southern Railway up to and through the 1982 merger,

>>> let's have a look at the fiscal policy of both roads.  As we all know, 

>>> the N&W

>>> was a financial success frm the outset all the way through the 

>>> depression

>>> years of the 1930's. But why in heavens name shouldn't it have been. 

>>> Like

>>> it's two counterparts, the Virginian and the C&O, all they had to do was

>>> lug coal  from the mines down to Tidewater for export.  Profitable, yes, 

>>> but

>>> about half of it's westbound traffic consisting of non-revenue empty 

>>> hopper

>>> trains.   Among other things the N&W would squeeze a nickel until the

>>> buffalo dropped dead.  I(n the early 70's while visiting family in

>>> Martinsville, Va., I would on occasion visit the local N&W operation. 

>>> The

>>> operator I talked with was cvrying the blues. THe N&W was beginning to

>>> install CTC between Roanoke and Winston -Salem and were planning to

>>> abolish every operator's job between those two  points. Anything to save

>>> a buck, right?   O.K., now let's check out policy on the Southern 

>>> Railway.

>>> I went to  work as an operator for Southern in 1968 on the extra board.

>>> In  October of that year yhey  created a new second trick operator's job

>>> in Gainesville.  I bid on the job, got it, and worked it for 18 years 

>>> until I

>>> retired and NEVER ONCE in that 18 years was I ever rolled off that job

>>> by an older operator. They ventually added a new third trick operator's

>>> job at Gainesville which gave continuous operator service during the 

>>> week.

>>> For the first couple of years after I went to work there was no relief 

>>> for

>>> the first trick operator on  Saturday or Sunday.  The first trick 

>>> operator

>>> agreed to work it on Saturday, and I agreed to work it on Sundays.  It 

>>> was

>>> 8 hours overtime for both of us.  I earned about enough overtime to put

>>> my youngest son through the University Of Georgia.  When I went to work

>>> for Southern the mast outside of the depot that once held upper quadrant

>>> train order signals was being used only as a support for the radio 

>>> antenna

>>> for the depot base radio station.  Southern Railway, mind  you, alkready

>>> had CTC  between Atlanta and Washington.   About   6 months after they

>>> put on my second trick job, things began to happen. The C&S Dept.

>>> re-installed the upper quadrant train order signals, including  lighting 

>>> the

>>> lights on the position lenses.   At the outset we were handing up orders 

>>> by

>>> hand using string delivery with a "Y" shaped train order hoop.   For 

>>> safety

>>> reasons  the trainmaster had Coster Shops in Knoxville fashion two metal

>>> delivery stands, one for either side as it was doubletrack through town.

>>> And a concrete base next to the track held a receptacle in which to 

>>> place

>>> the train order stand.  any times I had orders hanging on both sides for

>>> trains going in  both directions. The C&S Dept. also installed flood 

>>> lights

>>> on each side of the tracks to aid train crews in seeing the orders at 

>>> night.

>>> And our stationery supplies started including form "19" train order 

>>> pads,

>>> with carbon sheets for multiple copies, clearance cards, and balls of

>>> twine to string up the orders.  Of the various jobs we put to work 

>>> daily,

>>> one was an 11:00 PM switcher.   He was deliberately scheduled to begin

>>> work at 11:00 PM as during the period  8:00 PM until eleven there was

>>> Amtrak No. 820 aqnd the dispatcher regularly wanted to meet the "shots"

>>> as they were called in thaty doubletrack territory,. and a switcher 

>>> could

>>> hardly get any track time anyway until 11:00 PM.  My tour of duty ended

>>> at 10:15 PM, with no relief on Friday nights. For a few years I stayed 

>>> until

>>> 11:15 PM to put that job to work, which meant an hour of overtime. The

>>> Southern  Railway let well enough alone, but not the N&W.  That was not

>>> so much a merger as it was the N&W just taking over the Southern Ry.

>>> Within three months of the merger one night the trainmaster said  "Bill,

>>> we are going to have to move the eleven o'clock job up to 9:00 PM, as 

>>> they

>>> are making noises about your overtime on Fridays."  So there you have 

>>> it.

>>> Who in blazes is the cheapskate between the two companies?  Southern

>>> Railway could care less about the overtime, but that bunch of skinflints

>>> on the N&W want to account for every penny.  And I defy one of you

>>> N&W buffs to give me the name of a person in N&W management worthy

>>> of even holding the  coat of Southern Railway president D. W. Brosnan

>>> when it came to innovations to get traffic back on the railroad instead 

>>> of

>>> sitting on his butt hauling coal downhill to the docks, and going back 

>>> for

>>> more.  It took L. Stanly Crane, another good manager for Southern

>>> Railway to straighten out that Conrail fiasco and put it on a paying 

>>> basis.

>>> In the case of Norfolk Southern, it was another case of  the tail 

>>> wagging

>>> the dog when that merger took place.    Bill Sellers

>>>

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