[N&W] RE: What is the real reason ... ???

[nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org]

There was an accident I believe in the late 80's or early 90's where the
employee excursion train where the passenger cars derailed in rural
Chesapeake, VA. It was a part of the track that was real hard to access and
help did not arrive for around 1 hour. I do not believe there were too many
injuries and damage to the cars and track was minimal. A few weeks later the
program was dead.

Lets face it, we are living in the "no responsibility" era where people fail
to take responsibility for themselves and blame all of their problems on
others. These people would sue if the sun set 20 minutes earlier and caused
them emotional distress! Yes, it is expensive to run, fuel and maintain the
equipment but the insurance premiums would be astronomical. I would really
love to see that beautiful 611 race down the rails, but I guess I will just
have to remember taking the last run of the Pocahontas with my sister back
when we were kids. THAT was fun!!

Rob Wilson
_________________________________________________________
If I recall correctly (and I'll stand correction cheerfully), there was a
bill before the Virginia General Assembly some time ago that would
specifically limit liability for excursion operations (perhaps the Wilkins
bill mentioned by Roger Hofford). As I recall, it passed into law - but even
if you have a law limiting liability, that doesn't force the railroad to
accept it. So, it becomes a moot point - the law may say, "liability limted
to $X", but that doesn't prevent the railroad (especially the Legal
Department) from saying, "Nevertheless, we want $XXXXXXX worth of liability
insurance."

David McGrann

-----Original Message-----
From: N&W Mailing List [mailto:mailing-list at nwhs.org]
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 9:44 PM
To: N&W Mailing List
Subject: What is the real reason ... ???


Ben Blevins asks ...
  > WHAT IS THE REAL REASON THEY WON'T ALLOW EXCURSIONS ?

My guess is liability.

Things like true cost to run excursions, freight schedule interruptions and
personal dislike of steam or excursions are hard to call, but debatable. At
the same time, extreme liability is easy to figure and more difficult to
fault. Take the remote possibility of a half dozen full passenger cars
falling off a high trestle into a big ole river below ... the lawsuits could
put NS right out of business.

That crash scenario is extremely unlikely, but all the while still possible.
That's why we buy liability insurance for each trip, but I doubt $20 million
would cover the lawsuits for 300 riders drowning and the overage likely
would
fall to NS ... possibly enough overage to bankrupt the company. My guess is
the sponsoring club (e.g., NRHS chapter) likewise would go under and
possibly
the national organization, too. There's no telling how far the long arm of
the plaintiffs' legal beagles would reach -- chapter officers, NS board
members, wealthy chapter members ... you name it???

Ask yourself, would you put 100% of your financial assets on the line to
sponsor an excursion on, say, the Virginian from Mullens to Roanoke ... with
you holding 100% of the liability? Don't worry ... such an arrangement never
would be approved, but you get the idea that that is exactly what NS does
every time it runs an excursion (less the insurance).

Great idea ... bad math.

Enjoy the rails ... Bob Loehne, Present Day Steam Excursion Advocate
______________________________________________________________
In one word....LIABILITY!   There are many other reasons that went into the
decision, but that was the biggest one.  The Lynchburg accident in 1994 was
a wake-up call for NS management as far as liability was concerned.  They
were extremely lucky that accident occurred with the empty excursion train
and not with the train loaded with passengers.  The liability issue,
combined with all of the many other factors were more than enough for NS
management to quickly decide that it was time to end the steam program and
that is exactly what they did.  Despite what many railfans may think, the
steam program and excursions were not a profit generating venture.

It's quite laughable to hear railfans debate the PR value of steam
excursions.  Valuable to whom?  Yes, the railfan community sees this as
great PR and most of us certainly do wish that excursions were still run on
a regular basis.  But when it comes to shippers, 99% only care about one
thing.....that their freight makes it from point A to point B in a timely
manner, in good shape and at a reasonable cost.  In reality, if you were to
look into it, many shippers would be more apt to frown on steam or diesel
passenger excursions since such movements are liable to delay their freight
shipments.

Like it or not, people need to realize that times have changed and that the
likelihood of excursions being run regularly again is not very
probable.  And those who think that a company sponsored steam program will
return to NS in the future are only kidding themselves.  About the best
that can be expected would be for excursions sponsored by other groups to
be welcomed more openly in the future.  But at this point, NS management
must concentrate on their primary concern which is freight generated
revenue that translates to PROFIT in the bottom line.

Chris Toth
______________________________________________________________
I would suspect that one of the main reasons for no excursions is the high
cost of liability insurance. The last amount needed for an excursion that I
heard about was somewhere around One Hundred Million dollars per outing.
Think back to when NS ran the employee special that derailed and what they
had to pay out to injured employees.

Alan Cox
______________________________________________________________
Ben, I share your frustration. Part of the answer is the cost of liability
insurance. A while back Delegate & Speaker of the House Vance Wilkins
placed a bill in the Va. General Assembly to support steam excursion in his
district (Virginia Central RR). The ten million dollar insurance coverage
for CSX right-a-way was outrageous per my discussions with Del. Wilkins. It
seems folks are eager to sue if there is an accident these days and the last
thing a RR wants is a law suit.

Roger Hofford
Salem, VA